|Entered by||Joe Jupille|
|Checksums||shns , wavs|
|Disc Counts||1 / 2|
|Source Summary||Jerry Garcia Band, Late Show: MAC (Taped by Jerry Moore, spaced AKG D-200Es [from the orchestra, hand held, fairly close] > Sony TC-153 [Maxell XLII]) > Nakamichi Dragon playback > ART DI/O A-D converter > Egosys Waveterminal 2496 > Cool Edit 2000 > Plexwriter 12/10/32A master CD > HP 9350i extraction (EAC v0.9 beta 4) > sector boundary verification (shntool v1.01) > .shn encoding (mkwACT v0.97 beta 1).|
|Other Sources (comments)
Jerry Garcia Band: Late... (0) JGB; flac1644; late show;... (0)
|05/06/2003||Ryan Burns||What is the point of digitally transferring from cassette to the computer, then burning it onto a cd and EACing it to seed the show?|
|05/06/2003||Joe Jupille||Good question. I believe that these were burned to master CDs and the wavs erased from the hard drive before .shn'ing was anticipated. While re-transferring the cassettes is a theoretical possibility, it isn't a practical one, and so the master CDs were EAC'd to create the .shns.|
For the sake of all concerned if DAE is required then PLEASE include the EAC logs with the seeds. This simple step will give people the assurance they require that the required EAC step was done on a proper configuration and with solid, error-free results.
Please say hey to Jerry Moore for me !
A series of sometimes-funny comments made under some clever pseudonyms, the upshot of which is that some people are deeply concerned about digital audio extraction and others are less so, has been deleted.
I confess to being surprised that the above level of detail isn't enough, and that "for the sake of all involved" EAC logs should also be included in text files --I personally find them cumbersome and useless in an info file-- but I appreciate the point behind it and will consider adding EAC logs in the future.
|05/08/2003||Chris L.||adding a EAC log file does nothing to assure you that the appropriate settings were used during extraction - they can easily be faked or modified using a text editor. log files tell me what i assume everyone who is seeding shows is already doing (i hope). is someone gonna seed a show that they had extraction errors on that would show up in the log file? i'd rather seeds include wav md5s so i can verify that i have the same files before i burn to cd audio.|
For that matter any info can be faked, I hope, nay I pray, that no one would stoop to deception in these matters. I have found that many people, thinking that they are doing bit-accurate DAE are not doing so -- for instance not using secure mode, or not setting the offset properly -- these are well intentioned folks that thought that just because they used EAC to rip they were doing it "right" ... the log file helps all of us out here know that indeed an DAE step done with EAC is done "right". FWIW, I rip each disc and leave the EAC log files remain with these seeds that have a DAE step. It is just another "good practice" that helps document the seed to the extent possible.
|05/08/2003||Matt Vernon||I feel compelled to say that EAC, even in secure mode with proper offsets, does not guarantee that the resulting wav files are free of sound blemishes, though it is probably pretty close in flagging those blemishes that occur during the EAC step itself. To me, the effort should be expended on listening with headphones to the music while simultaneously "viewing" the music in spectral view with say a 5 second viewing window and doing so with complete sets to confirm what happens at the track transitions. In this way you will see all flaws (and then some) that you can hear. These should be noted in the info file if you aren't adept at repairing them. This adds more value to me than EAC logs which say nothing about any sound blemishes on the disks that you received.|
i have regularly confirm that i can a quick QC test to make sure i'm "doing" exact audio copying by comparing preburn and postburn extraction wav md5s to make sure they match. i agree with matt's spectral analysis protocol - it definitely cuts down on easily preventable glitches which can then be documented after being fixed. i don't like having all these separate shntool output or log files - probably good to include them at the bottom of the info files though again, i'm not seeding something unless i get >99% error-free. too many opportunities for viruses and trash build up. too bad joe will delete this later tonight ;)
"i'd rather seeds include wav md5s..."
I agree that this would move closer to full verification of the files that are circulating...
Why not use the shntool md5s? "shntool md5 *.shn" returns the same checksum as does "shntool md5 *.wav" (assuming the WAVs came from the same SHNs). This checksum is also the one that is reported in a .ffp (FLAC fingerprint). As it is the checksum of the audio data only, the shntool md5 verifies exactly that information with which we are concerned.
More info about shntool .md5s here (I had to ask to get it straight).
The tape with the last song has been found, and a completely new transfer (w/o DAE!) has been done. Despite some lingering questions about the mics, this new seed is closely-enough related to this one that I have decided to list it in comments here rather than as a whole new entry. It's a close call. Anyway, information follows below.
Jerry Garcia Band
Calderone Concert Hall, Hempstead, NY
July 8, 1977 - Late Show
Recorded by Jerry Moore; Sony ECM-33Ps> Sony TC-152
Master played backed on a Nak Dragon> ART DI/O> Waveterminal 2496> Hard Drive Tracking in Cool Edit 2000; Burned with Feurio Error checked with SHNTOOL; .wav>SHN with mkwACT
A>D>SHN by David Minches
1. Crowd/Tuning [0:32]
2. Harder They Come [14:50] [0:36]
3. They Love Each Other [0:04] [7:20] [1:07]
4. Russian Lullaby [15:23] [0:14]
5. Midnight Moonlight [10:47] [0:21]
1. Crowd/Tuning [0:30]
2. Tore Up Over You [10:54] [1:22]
3. Knockin' On Heaven's Door [17:32] [0:13]
4. Tangled Up In Blue [13:38] [0:32]
6d7eac17188f4b5abf2c94e9eabb90ae *jgb1977-07-08bd1t01.shn bdf2c98df578255b9f55c07ebc741c71 *jgb1977-07-08bd1t02.shn 5c1e9f0da0181262fe8f56df75721184 *jgb1977-07-08bd1t03.shn af84ba81178d984a9d493990c3f7fdc8 *jgb1977-07-08bd1t04.shn 0af08b543fd435386ca5e4c3050636f8 *jgb1977-07-08bd1t05.shn
497c49244acf44ac9d7aafa080e5cbf9 *jgb1977-07-08bd2t01.shn b82b21e4399d4ff08a6b23115352b0c3 *jgb1977-07-08bd2t02.shn b03472d89ce76948984dcf3ebf47fcb4 *jgb1977-07-08bd2t03.shn deba5398f0e5f6573bd55bcf168099e6 *jgb1977-07-08bd2t04.shn